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the hands of Ministers would undoubtedly be to be exerted; and I said that I wished those with whom I might act, and the King (if he called upon me), to be fully apprized of the grounds on which I should necessarily proceed. He received all I said extremely well; and though much of his discourse seemed to aim at instilling other ideas, he never directly objected to what I stated. He ended our interview with expressing an earnest wish that the King might get rid of the present Ministry, and seemed anxious to see me again before he goes abroad, which he still talks of doing next week. I have fixed to dine with him on Tuesday, when I shall probably hear more on these subjects.

My opinion at present is, that though he was sounding to see whether something might not be formed more on the foundation of the old politics of the Court, he will see that that is out of the question; but that such a Government may, nevertheless, be formed as will be justly much more acceptable to the King than the present. I think, therefore, what has passed will not tend to delay our having the offer whenever things are ripe for it. I hope, too, that it has tended to put the business on such a ground as can alone make it advisable or honourable; and I flatter myself I shall have the happiness to find that it strikes your Lordship in the same manner.

I am ever, my dear Lord, &c.,

W. PITT.

MY DEAR SIR,

Earl Temple to Mr. Pitt.1

Stowe, July 21, 1783. Nothing can be more clear than the whole of your detail of the conversation with Lord Thurlow, and your conclusions drawn from it. He has spoken much of this from himself, as the whole tenour of his language is perfectly congenial with his feelings, but the great outline was clearly drawn in the closet on Friday. The King, I have no doubt, is in earnest, so is his Lordship; but they both wish to try that which is perfectly natural, namely, how far concessions may be gained from us upon points which press hard upon that general system under which they formerly governed. To the Parliamentary Reform you are pledged whenever there is a reasonable prospect of success, and from that you cannot recede with the fair fame which I ever wish to you.

As to the other reform, the great objects have been missed, and some parts have not done credit to the reformers, and possibly (with the best intentions) the experiment is hazardous if carried at once to its utmost extent; but whatever we may think upon time or mode, I am most clearly and decisively of opinion that we cannot be too explicit in our refusal to engage in government upon the avowed or implied system of replacing in the hands of the Crown that influence which has been already taken from it, excepting in any instance (if such there be) where an improper new

1 There was no copy of this | original is among the papers left letter in the Stowe Collection as by Mr. Pitt.

put up for sale in 1862; but the

arrangement may make a change necessary, not for influence, but for the proper administration of each department; and even this last exception should be kept out of sight, in order that no superstructure may be built by Lord Thurlow upon it. The idea of the change originating in an offer or in an eagerness from us cannot be allowed; nor do I see the necessity of it, as I think it clear that the King is in earnest, and that he is not more anxious than Lord Thurlow. What then is his object? Not to continue his present Ministry; not to patch one with Lord North and the old Government, who cannot now undertake it even with Lord Thurlow and Lord Gower; not to depend solely upon Lord Gower. What then is his alternative? The very arrangement which he now has in view, but which he will endeavour to bring as near as possible to his ideas; and a strong proof of it is the affected mystery with which Lord Thurlow held back the opinions of Lord Gower and Lord Weymouth, which to me, upon a former occasion, he quoted at every moment, and particularly entered into the specification of the kind of office for Lord Gower; and ridiculous as the reason may appear, it seems to me that he keeps that name back, for fear of pledging his Lordship too far in a business which he probably now thinks nearer than it was when he first spoke.

However, be all this as it may, our line cannot admit of a moment's doubt; and you have seized it precisely as I knew you would, with clearness and with credit, by holding out an inclination to accept in proper circumstances any offer from His Majesty; but by disavowing

any impatience, which just inverts the ground upon which we can best stand. One thing only I wish to be stated, if you approve it; and if you have any delicacy as to yourself, it may be stated as my language to you, namely, the very essential difference between an offer made now, with the means of strengthening ourselves, or hereafter, in a moment of distress, to His Majesty, and of equal difficulty to those upon whom he calls: increased likewise by the inference which individuals will draw from the countenance given to the present Ministry even of one hour from the moment in which he can dismiss them. This may be urged totally distinct from any idea of impatience, and I think that (upon the supposition that your conversation will be repeated) we owe it to the King not to conceal what makes so capital a part of our creed, and particularly in a moment when the inclination to change is palpable, although it is wished to transfer the first movements from the King, from whom they really proceed, to us, who are in fact his only resource.

As to the observations drawn from Lord Thurlow's account of the King's language, I admit them to be strong; but if his Lordship had not stated them, I would have trusted human nature, and peculiarly that of His Majesty, for the continuance of his feelings upon the subject of his present Ministers. I would not therefore, in conversation with Lord Thurlow, admit of any merit from this perseverance as partial or flattering to us; and still less would I give to Lord Thurlow any clue by which His Majesty is to have an insight into a future Ministry. If this is to be a negotiation, let it be

avowed; and in whatever manner it is conveyed, the answer in general may return by the same channel, but the particulars can be settled only personally with the King; and you sufficiently remember what passed between Lord Shelburne and Lord Rockingham in March, 1782, not to be very cautious upon anything which may give that light which must be the consequence and not the cause of a negotiation; and if after all this explanation Lord Thurlow runs away to Spa, or declines engaging further, I must think that the King's line is marked, and that he will get through the summer, and leave the change to be forced in Parliament; a system which you will not think very likely to prevail in his mind.

Under all these circumstances, all we can do is voir venir, taking every means to undeceive the King as to any idea of our changing our system for that which, as an individual, has no charms for me, further than as I am acting with you. My groom, who carries this letter, has orders to wait for your answer, which will probably be very short, as I cannot think that Lord Thurlow will open further till he sees clearly that he cannot succeed in the game which he is now playing. Adieu, my dear Pitt, believe me, with the truest regard, and affection founded upon esteem,

Most sincerely yours,
NUGENT TEMPLE.

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