was impossible for him to remain in command, | lions would fail.] And it had failed preand that he had better make his arrangements cisely as he had indicated. He printed for retiring quietly. The result was that Colonel was made Inspecting Field Officer the paper in the following year.

of one of the best recruiting districts in England; Quartermaster obtained the honorary rank of Captain, and was allowed to retire on that rank; and the Quartermaster Sergeant was pensioned, and made a clerk at the War Office."

This, as he had said, occurred long ago; if it had been a recent case, he would not have mentioned it. But it showed, he thought, that undue leniency was exercised when severity ought to have been used. On the other hand, he had often found that undue severity had been used when leniency ought to have been shown, and that officers were removed for unnecessary causes. His experience extended to two such cases. He had had occasion to obtain the reinstatement of two officers who had been

manner.

"The principle of the amalgamation which the Government seek to obtain by the recent changes would appear to be to destroy the individual interest and traditions of regiments, and henceforth to regard only those of the United Brigade; but the steps taken to carry be effectual, the county names and traditions of this principle into effect are not complete. To individual regiments must in future be merged in the county name and the traditions of the brigade in which they are linked together. The the officers in it; but they are of less importtraditions of a regiment are very interesting to ance to the country than a good organization, and must yield before the superior advantage of a perfect fusion of two regiments into one brigade, which the Government desire, but tions are fostered, and precedence, &c., rewhich cannot be complete as long as old traditained."

He

was, perhaps, too much a reformer improperly removed from the Army in for his own benefit. The part of the consequence of improper Reports which system to which he chiefly objected was had not been investigated in a proper number of mounted officers. the increase that was made to the The right The system of compulsory re- hon. Gentleman proposed to double the tirement caused great hardship in many cases; and he would mention one such number of mounted officers-that was case. General Shute, when a Member of to say, instead of three mounted officers the House of Commons, was offered the there would be six in future; and that post of Inspector General of Cavalry-a was being done while the total number post to which all Cavalry officers aspired. of officers had been reduced 480. Again, General Shute would have accepted it, why had the second lieutenant-colonels but the Minister of War of the day been appointed, seeing they had nothing begged him not to take the appointment, tenant-colonels had been reduced, beto do? In his own time second lieuand to remain in the House of Commons, tenant-colonels had been reduced, bewhere his presence was desired by the cause they had been found to be useless Secretary of State for War. General and sometimes mischievous. And why Shute accordingly declined the post, were they going to reduce the number of hoping to have his turn some other time. the very men that were wanted-namely, What happened? He had been pro to say that he had hoped when the right the subalterns? He only wished further moted more rapidly than had been expected; and now General Shute was to be hon. Gentleman came into Office, he would turned out as rubbish and refuse that have tackled the great reform so much was of no use in the Army. Dealing wanted by persons both in and out of with the regimental system, he would the Army-the placing of the adminispoint out that Mr. Gathorno Hardy de- tration of the Army on the same footing clined to adopt it; and he thought that as the administration of the Navy, and right hon. Gentleman acted on very good giving more public access to the different reason in doing so. He (Sir Alexander positions in the administration of the Army. No Government had hitherto Gordon) thought the scheme was objectionable in different ways; and, while had the courage to press it; but it was a he said so, he hoped the right hon. Gen- reform that was much wanted, and he tleman the Secretary of State for War would have been glad if the right hon. did not think he was one of those who Gentleman had seen his way to underwas opposed to all change. To show take it. He begged to move the Amendthis, the hon. and gallant Gentleman ment of which he had given Notice. read an extract from a paper he had Amendment proposed, given to Mr. Cardwell in 1873, pointing! To leave out from the word "That" to the out where his scheme of linked batul- | end of the Question, in order to add the words

-instead thereof.

Question proposed, "That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Question."

"in the opinion of this House, it is not desirable | Crimean War broke out magnificent to carry into effect that part of the new Army regiments of the finest soldiers started scheme, recently laid upon the Table, which authorises the compulsory retirement of efficient for the seat of war. Three months afterofficers under 70 years of age, but that increased wards, when the "shine" had been inducements to voluntary retirement should be taken out of them, and many of them substituted therefor, according to the original were hors de combat, there was no Replan laid down by Lord Cardwell, and sancserve to fall back upon to fill up their tioned by Parliament in 1871,"-(Sir Alexander Gordon,) ranks. The consequence was that the highways and hedges had to be searched for recruits-and it would have been well had that been all; but as they had also to go into the back slums of all our great cities for them, boys were sent out who were perfectly unfit for duty, so that Lord Raglan had to beg the authorities at home for Heaven's sake to send out no more of such recruits, because they were clogging the hospitals long before they came in face of the enemy. The long-service system had broken down, and in favour of a short service there appeared to him to be three convincing reasons. With the long-service system they could have no Reserve; there was an enormous non-effective charge upon the Army; and they were embarrassed with a very large number of married

SIR ROBERT LOYD-LINDSAY said, he wished to remind hon. Members that the hon. and gallant Baronet (Sir Alexander Gordon) had condemned the late quite as strongly as he had the present Government in connection with this subject; and from that circumstance he felt that he could safely congratulate the House and the country on the fact that the reform of the Army was not made a Party question. He (Sir Robert LoydLindsay) thought that the right hon. Gentleman had gone as far as he could properly go in the scheme he had sub-soldiers, who needed expensive barracks, mitted, and quite as far as he could go in his concessions to those who had advocated the claims of the Colours in preference to the claims of the Reserve. He had no difficulty whatever in understanding the views and the feelings which officers of the Army held with regard to the maintaining the efficiency of the Colours. It was quite natural that an officer who had taken very great pains with the men under his command, and brought them to a high state of discipline, should view with great reluctance the prospect of seeing them moved off to the unknown limbo of the Reserves; but the Secretary of State had to consider in what way he could supply the place of those whom a war would place hors de combat. His hon. and gallant Friend the Member for West Sussex (Sir Walter B. Barttelot) was therefore tinged with the unfairness of those who argued in favour of long service, and carefully ignored its disadvantages, and he could not agree with his hon. and gallant Friend in the criticisms he had made upon the short-service system. Long service, of course, produced a limited number of fine troops; but the losses incident to a long campaign, such as that in the Crimea, made all its weak points only too evident. When the

and who, though very steady in time of peace, were home-sick in war time. No doubt, commanding officers were very well pleased when they were not on active service to have married soldiers in the ranks, because they were steady and well-behaved; but on active service nothing could be worse. The Warrant said that in India the service would be for eight years, and that for men abroad it might be extended to eight; and then it went on to say that the Secretary of State would not be precluded from extending the term to 12 years. That would be a blow at the Reserve, which had never been very brilliant, but had come out very well when called for. Many officers prophesied that the Reserve which was on paper would never be heard of; but, unluckily for the prophets, at least 95 per cent of the men appeared, and were excellent soldiers. But the prophets were on their legs again. He therefore hoped the right hon. Gentleman (Mr. Childers) would do his best to make the Reserve highly efficient. His hon. and gallant Friend said that the employers of labour ought to be looked after. Certainly they ought. He hoped that Railway Companies and others who refused to employ Reserve men would have their names mentioned in the House, and their

men.

unpatriotic conduct denounced.
was one class of Militia colonels during
the Crimean War who would not let their
men pass into the Line. Other colonels
took a more patriotic course, and did
better service to the country. He should
like to see included under the 13th para- |
graph the men of the Army Hospital
Corps. His right hon. Friend had per-
mitted a certain portion of artificers,
drummers, and buglers to extend their
period of service for 21 years, so as to
earn pensions. He would appeal to his
right hon. Friend to allow the Army
Hospital Corps men to go in for pensions.
They had to attend to the sick and
wounded, and men of 35 and more were
better fitted for that duty than younger
He would make another appeal
to his right hon. Friend on behalf of
corporals. He knew that, with the leave
of their commanding officers, they might
serve for pensions; but the soldier on
taking the stripes ought to know whe-
ther he would be allowed to make the
Army his career. He gave his cordial
support to the principle of territorial regi-
ments. It was the principle of his right
hon, and gallant Friend (Colonel Stan
ley), and was proposed in his Committee.
In the germs of that proposal there was
the probability of a great success. But
he regretted that the right hon. Gentle-
man had not included in those territorial
regiments the Volunteers where that
could be done. With regard to the
depot centres, the right hon. Gentleman
ought to consider how the scheme, which
was a thoroughly good one, might be
made to work. Although £3,000,000
had been spent upon it, the plan wanted
more money to make it thoroughly effi-
cient. They had the buildings for the
depot centres scattered over the country;
but hardly one of them was fit to receive
a regiment of the Line or of the Militia.
Until the counties should, from time to
time, see their regiments among them,
and hear their bands play in the streets,
the territorial system would languish.
If the right hon. Gentleman would call
to his aid his Financial Secretary (Mr.
Campbell-Bannerman), who had for six
years spoken on military affairs with such
authority from the Opposition Benches,
perhaps the money might be found.

There randum he (Colonel Alexander) had submitted on the case of the quartermasters, and for the concessions the right hon. Gentleman had made to them; but he must guard himself against being supposed entirely to approve of everything that had been done in that direction. There were two or three points to which he wished to direct attention, and he would ask the right hon. Gentleman to consider, even at the 11th hour, whether he could not make some slight modifications in the Memorandum. 18. 6d. a-day increase was to be given to the quartermasters for 20 years' service upwards, and that seemed a very substantial improvement; but it was only a very slight improvement, and not in any way a substantial one. Of all the quartermasters in the active and Regular Army only five would come under the operation of the concession, and one of those five would be placed on half-pay in three months, and so would immediately forfeit the benefit. Then the rule obliging quartermasters to retire on completing 55 years of age would debar them. from hoping to obtain this increase, so that the real increase which remained would be the magnificent sum of 4d. a-day. The right hon. Gentleman would earn the gratitude of the quartermasters if he would consider the advisability of granting this additional 18. 6d. after 16 years, instead of after 20 years. Of the quartermasters six or eight would be obliged to retire on the 1st of July, and two within three months of that date, and he hoped the right hon. Gentleman would give those unfortunate men a little breathing time, in order that they might obtain new employment. hardest case would be this-A and B were two quartermasters, aged 55 years. A would complete 10 years' service on June 30th as a quartermaster, and would be allowed to remain three years longer; but B, completing his 10 years on the following day, would be obliged to retire immediately. That was not an equitable arrangement. What special virtue was there in 55 years? If that rule were applied to the Cabinet, he feared the country would lose some of its brightest and most illustrious ornaments immediately, and he was afraid even COLONEL ALEXANDER said, he had the right hon. Gentleman himself (Mr. to thank the right hon. Gentleman (Mr. | Childers) would not long survive the Childers; for the kind way in which he application of the rule. Then the maxihad taken into consideration the Memo-mum retiring allowance for quarter

The

"To move, That the Army Retirement scheme, as embodied in the June Memorandum, entails considerable and unnecessary expense, and that this unnecessary expense is largely owing to the most prominent feature of the scheme, namely, the compulsory retirement of officers whilst they are physically fit for service; said, that while agreeing that the Memorandum of the right hon. Gentleman was good, as far as it went, in reference to the cases of non-commissioned officers, he thought it did not throw open a sufficient number of commissions to such officers. He also thought that the position of the private soldier was in no way improved. As regarded them, he thought the Secretary of State for War was making two mistakes in totally opposite directions; the fact being that the proposals of the right hon. Gentleman would have the effect of keeping on the bad characters in the Army, and of discharging the good men after shorter service. What should be done was just the contrary of this-the bad men should be got into the Reserve as quickly as possible, and the good men kept on active service as an example to others. As far as the commissioned officers were concerned, he could not help thinking that the present proposal was one which could only result in giving a new lease of life to the bad system of compulsory retirement of captains at 40 years of age, just when they had become most competent for the discharge of their duties. That system, which was a very bad one, was introduced by the Conservative Government in 1877. He Major Nolan) objected to it, believing that it would not only inflict hardship on the officers affected, but involve a cost of at least £1,200,000. There was, he would point out, no other Military Service in Europe by which men were retired at the early age of 40, and so strong was his objection to this practice flat, although he did not altogether approve of the Motion of the hon. and gallant Member for East Aberdeenshire Sir Alexander Gordon), thinking his own Motion rather preferable to it, he would gladly vote for it, as it contained a strong protest against the system of

retiring officers when they were fit for service.

or

LORD EUSTACE CECIL said, that he hoped no one would speak for more than a quarter of an hour, or that if he did some one would pull him down by the coat tail. He should confine his observations to one or two subjects connected with that large question. And, first, he would touch on the point of expense, to which he more particularly wished to address himself. As regarded that point, it might have been expected that some hen. Gentleman below the Gangway opposite would have got up and talked about the great extravagance of the Army Estimates; but he (Lord Eustace Cecil) never observed that on a military night, whatever might have been said in election speeches, anyone got up, except the hon. Baronet the Member for Carlisle (Sir Wilfrid Lawson), to suggest that the Army Estimates were extravagant, although hon. Gentlemen did get up and call for additional expenditure. Since he (Lord Eustace Cecil) had been in Parliament, the Army Estimates had risen from £12,000,000 to £13,000,000, to £15,000,000 £16,000,000. That was a very portentous fact; but, as regarded it, he did not want to find fault with any particular Administration, and certainly not with the present Secretary of State for War. He knew that his right hon. Friend had a great many difficult questions to settle, and he was bound to say that everything he had done had been marked by courtesy, painstaking, and care, very creditable to a Secretary of State for War. Of course, he could not find fault with his immediate Predecessor (Colonel Stanley), nor with Lord Cranbrook, both of whom succeeded to legacies of embarrassment. But he must say that a great responsibility rested on Lord Cardwell's Administration. Almost all the questions that were now causing difficulty arose out of what was done by that noble Lord. He (Lord Eustaco Cecil) had opposed Lord Cardwell's scheme at the time, and pointed out what the country was committed to by it. The fact was, that in 10 years it had cost the country £25,500,000, or £3,000,000 a-year. That total included purchase of commissions, £8,000,000; brigade depôts, £3,500,000; waste on short service, £3,500,000; and officers' retirement scheme, £10,500,000;

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